Use the existing inventory! We have plenty of high school seats. Several schools are projected to be under capacity, even if HS-6 is built. I think Dr. Hatrick is correct, enrollment projections are likely to change. Let's wait until those numbers come in, then make a decision. What's the big rush? Wait till next year to make this $100M decision. Giving HS-6 the go ahead now sends taxpayers like me the wrong message. If the BOS can just nod and approve $100M, then you best be able to fully fund the sheriff department and the library system.
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Frankly, I am shocked this is even on the table for discussion.

Posted by maravetz (anonymous) on March 18, 2009 at 5:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If we need more space in the high schools, why don't we just use more modular/trailer classrooms?

Posted by GenuineRisk (anonymous) on March 18, 2009 at 5:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes, not to mention, there are several other school construction projects ahead of HS-6 in the CIP, such as the delayed HS-7 which is voter approved and awaiting a site. Will some supervisors try to kill any site selection for HS-7 to ensure that HS-6 gets built first? Just wondering.....

Posted by momof2 (anonymous) on March 18, 2009 at 5:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Mr. Kravitz, have you looked at the Staff Recommendation that you said drops enrollment numbers? High school boundaries don't come into play until Fall of 2010, and at that time SBHS is at 1808, just a bit more than BWHS's 1704. Oh, and take a look at Heritage at 1108, County at 1145 and Tuscarora at 1219. Wow, looks like there's some room at some schools that we all know "were built with everyone's tax dollars." If a Loudoun County student needs a desk it appears to me that Loudoun County schools have quite a few available, even through 2013 using a "worst case" scenario in growth.

Posted by slkipps1206 (anonymous) on March 19, 2009 at 8:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Just a note about Heritage having "space". Heritage is currently 200 students over capacity, same as Stone Bridge. When Tuscarora HS opens, Heritage will get some relief, temporarily. New developments at Oaklawn, Potomac Station, Wegman's Center, and final townhome buildout in Kincaid, will all be funneled into Heritage within the next few years, which will eat up whatever "relief" they get from Tuscarora's opening. That is why the School Board doesn't want to move the Lansdowne kids to Leesburg. There simply is no room. I'd go back and find out just WHO approved all those bazillion homes in Lansdowne, without thinking about future students. Those folks need to be tarred, feathered and run out of town!

Posted by GenuineRisk (anonymous) on March 19, 2009 at 9:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

risk, an article in the Post Metro today now forecasts Loudoun at twentieth in pace of growth.

Not sure how they do the numbers for the rankings used in the article, but I DO know that the ONE year Loudoun was number one "fastest growing" (2003?), it was calculated by percentage of increase in relation to existing population.

In that one survey that put us at the very top (still being milked, in some quarters), a county in one of the Carolinas made the top 100 for adding 60 people, and LA County didn't make the list at all, even though it had added more people than lived in Loudoun at the time.

In this economic climate, and with the foreclosure mess yet to fully unravel (and in spite of the trillions of wet-ink dollars being flooded out), are you certain those developments are going to build out in the next few years?

If Dulles south can do without relief schools AT ALL, and be bused to utilize existing capacity until three and one year late schools--both voter approved--are built, why is that necessity only applicable to certain communities?

If we're in a crunch as a county financially, aren't we ALL in a crunch?

Posted by BarbaraMunsey (anonymous) on March 19, 2009 at 10:15 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The proposed fast tracking (read non public vote) of HS-6 by Lori Waters is fiscally unsound.This is $200 million dollar + "$X" bill(more on that math later)Loudoun County cannot afford or need. Please take a look at plans 564 or 592 there is a solution.

The math
$100 million to build the school
"$X" = Cost of salaries to staff HS-6
$100 million increase in bond interest once we lose our AAA rating. Watch the the last half of the video on the link of a March 4th BOS/School Board meeting
http://lcps.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php...... #4

If you were mad because you thought we could save $25 million by building HS-6 now .. you should now be irate or worse at the thought of spending $100 million on increased bond interest rates HS-6 would cause on all Loudoun County debt.

This debt will increase our already high taxes in Loudoun County.

Please email Lori Waters, the media and the BOS and school board. HS-6 is a $200 million + fiscal mistake Loudoun County cannot afford

Posted by rlmccoy45 (anonymous) on March 19, 2009 at 10:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Yeah, fast-track a school in Eastern Loudoun but yet delay, obfuscate and otherwise plod along on HS-3 that is in critical need of being built in Western Loudoun. This entire thing smacks of political cronyism.

Posted by SavedByZero (anonymous) on March 20, 2009 at 8:15 a.m. (Suggest removal)

At my local elementary school yesterday, teachers were updated on the RIF notice(reduction in force) procedures that come before pink slips from Loudoun County Public Schools. The teachers who will potentially be riffed will find out in the next few weeks. Since there is no budget yet, many teachers who may end up keeping their jobs will get RIF notices just in case. Loudoun County is so broke it is firing teachers despite adding 2000+ new students next year. The public leaders who push for new spending now on HS-6, when many voters can see that HS-6 is not yet needed, may find themselves as popular as the bailout executives who thought it was a good time to redecorate and award bonuses.

Posted by charsj (anonymous) on March 20, 2009 at 11:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)

HS-6 does not ONLY benefit 500 Lansdowne kids. The CIP CLEARLY states that HS-6 is to releive 3 high schools (Broad Run, Stone Bridge and Briar Woods). Moving the initial 500 (a number that grows to 715) Lansdowne children to Central Louduon would mean overcrowding the Central Loudoun schools in a few years along with requiring even more boundary changes for a town that recently celebrated its 250th anniversary. Is it even possible to calculate how many boundary changes have occurred in Leesburg?

Arguing that HS-6 causes more boundary changes simply isn't true. Without HS-6 we will have more temporary boundary changes and not just in the Dulles area.

Posted by lttbt (anonymous) on March 21, 2009 at 10:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)

lttbt, I wish people would make up their minds where central and north consist of, then stick to it.

Schools are planned by cluster, and new boundaries affect neighboring clusters.

If you watched the finance committee meeting from the other day, when some tried to keep coming back to this talking point, that HS6 was planned to relieve three schools, the answer clearly came back that HS6 was the planned relief for Briar Woods.

If Briar Woods cluster is overcrowded deliberately from the north and the south (I mean the directions, not the supposed classification of the moment), through forced boundary changes that ONLY affect certain communities, and leaves others untouched, then it can make HS6 look necessary.

It still does not address the issue of the expensive empty seats, and the acceleration of a $100M expenditure into a budget that the Board of Supervisors directed was to include NO capital expenditures.

Posted by BarbaraMunsey (anonymous) on March 21, 2009 at 1:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Barbara – I can understand why you are confused by what is central and north because you are not part of either. Those in central and north know who they are. Schools are planned by cluster and those clusters are shown in the CIP (http://cmsweb1.loudoun.k12.va.us/5099051... ).
I’m not sure if the 90% shoving of the Ashburn Farm community was a typo, but the plans that they are supporting yank 100% of the Lansdowne community out of their feeder high school temporarily and cause even more boundary changes in the future that will involve a much greater number of children.
I applaud Supervisors Burton and Waters for addressing the needs and well being of children as something that should be considered and made that part of the discussion. During these difficult times our children are in even greater need of stability. Unfortunately a price tag can not be put on that for an analysis that some want to make strictly about cash. If an opportunity exists that allows us to build a much needed high school at a bargain price and that can provide an economic stimulus to our county, let’s discuss it.
HS-6 is not the threat to HS-7. The only threat to HS-7 is that it doesn’t have approved land. What happens if land is not found and approved for HS-7? Have we learned nothing from the Woodgrove experience? Where are you going to bus those kids then (Loudoun Valley and Park View have some space)? HS-6 would be a better option if it was built. How much of a premium are the citizens of Loudoun going to have to pay to get HS-7 to open on time? Let’s not box ourselves into a corner with so few options to get out.

Posted by leafofmaple (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 10:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The discussion of HS-6 and the current boundary process is being done in a vacuum because this move sets up the next DRASTIC move. We need to be thinking ahead to the next boundary change because it will split the backbone of Ashburn Farm and the Broadlands if the Staff Plan goes through.
The 3/10 Staff Plan grossly over populates Stone Bridge and Briar Woods. It also sets up the next move where EVERY ASHBURN FARM student south of Hay Road will be moved out - confimed this week. This is what the percentage was referring to. This massive southern migration disrupts the BROADLANDS. Any child south of Truro Parish/Waxpool road will go to Stone Hill MS and HS-6. Look at the statistics. It is all supported by the planning staff numbers and we have the spreadsheets to prove it.
Ashburn Farm solutions are NOT about trying to "move Lansdowne out Stone Bridge". We are actually trying to protect large communities from massive disruptions. We of all communities should know. We want ALL COMMUNITIES to get to go to High School together. Lansdowne in their High School, Ashburn Farm at Stone Bridge, the Broadlands in Briar Woods and Brambleton at HS-6 (the latter two to be determined with boundaries for HS-6).
WE WANT TO PROTECT COMMUNITIES. The feeder system at this point in our evolution divdes and conquers. We need to change the way we are thinking and planning.
Also, to correct a quote, the statement "Our flaw is we don't have a feeder system for the elementary school to middle school" is not what I said. The fact is that we don't feed from the elementary, we feed from the middle school. To fix this problem, we need to think High School down and beautiful solutions become evident that keep communities together.
Wendy Wooley

Posted by ashburnfarmmom (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 11:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

leafofmaple, that's sweet of you to be concerned about my confusion.

It comes (the confusion), perhaps deliberately, from the changes in classification depending on which talking point is being made.

It sounds sometimes like the sales ads for condos in Bethesda that describe the location as "upper Georgetown".

One of the issues here is stability, and there is no such thing for communities in flux.

Ashburn Farm and immediate environs are built out.

It makes no sense to uproot any portion of that community and transfer it to an area still in flux (Briar Woods cluster) which will continue to see growth through the cohort and new building in Brambleton and Broadlands.

Lansdowne is still in flux, and has a lot more growing to do.

Drawing a line in the sand for stability for one community that has not yet acheived growth buildout, and implementing it by disrupting a stable community into crowding adjoining clusters, is bad planning, and smacks of favoritism in a system supposed to be PUBLIC.

Granted, the proposal protects Lansdowne, but at what cost?

I mean, besides the cost of the new school that would be accelerated into the current budget?

It is not the school board's fault that the BoS chose to kill two schools.

In fact, it might be instructive to look back on that vote, and see Mrs. Waters' comments.

They had to do exclusively with HS6, which could indicate in retrospect that her focus was not on the application at hand, but on her own plans for doing the school board's job.

Her justification for voting against HS7, after two questions on HS6, was that it was "fiscally irresponsible" to support it, and that "existing capacity" had to be used until a better solution could be found.

Now we have her supposedly "better" solution (apparently for one community, at the expense of many others), and it has ZERO to do with "fiscal responsibility" and effective "utilization of existing capacity".

I guess it depends on what day it is, and whose ox is perceived as being gored?

Posted by BarbaraMunsey (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 11:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Wendy makes a great point that is overlooked.
Lori Waters talks of keeping the community together but supports Hay Road as a boundary line for Stone Bridge High School
Look at a map - Hay Road is DIRECTLY in front of Stone Bridge High School ... students who today live across the street and walk to their COMMUNITY high school (Stone Bridge) would be bused miles away.
Lori Waters and Burton are NOT for keeping community together they are for spending $100 Million + interest + staff for unneeded HS-6. Money (= increased taxes) Loudoun County residence cannot afford or need to spend.

Posted by rlmccoy45 (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 11:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

leaf, et all, I really have to throw this in: Barbara Munsey knows quite a bit about ALL of this county, land use, procedures, etc, etc, because she served on the Planning Commission. It is really not appropriate to denigrate her knowledge of the county. In addition, as these boundaries and facilities have repercussions throughout the county, I think all of us are justified in adding our two-cents to the discussion.

Posted by momof2 (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 12:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Which developer proffered the Briar Woods site? I thought it was part of Brambleton, not the Broadlands. Are people who live across the street from Briar Woods going to be sent to HS-6 in Loudoun Valley Estates during the next reboundary process? What dominos are we stacking here by moving so many communities away from their neighborhood schools? Is there no link any more between the proffer of a school site and the proffering development actually attending that school? Yes, a school belongs to Loudoun County, not a particular development, but school boundaries are getting bizarre.

Posted by charsj (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 1:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes, Brambleton has a very good chance of not going to the school that they can see. That was said by the Planning Staff back during the Stone Hill/Eagle Ridge planning process 3 years ago. As we know by the Ashburn Farm situation, proffering a site means nothing. On that same point, many Broadlands citizens will also not attend Eagle Ridge Middle School which they proffered. There is only room for the students that attend Hillside ES because it will be full of Ashburn Farm students sent south. Most of the kids that attend Mill Run ES will be pushed south to Stone Hill MS.
Wendy

Posted by ashburnfarmmom (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 1:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Momof2, I think that's why I specifically am supposed to shut up!

I don't know everything, that's for sure, but I DO know enough to recognize the same game plan that was run to delay Freedom for several years.

Once the Board of Supervisors accelerates this NOW into the county CIP, it preemprtively makes the decision for the school board when they revisit their own next fall (and our kids are pumping the feeder numbers from beneath with the Mercer boundary that takes effect this fall).

All some of the same supervisors need to do is not find any site acceptable (or "fiscally responsible", since we can "utilize existing capacity", for some and some only) for HS7.

The switch will be made next fall in the school CIP, because the projection formulae will be based on the new boundaries, and the fact that the BoS has made HS6 funding a promise; they will have said the county can afford it by accelerating it and putting it on the ballot.

The other option will be to build both together (which still doesn't address available seats in Leesburg, or the community disruption in Dulles) and I thought next year's budget was supposed to be worse than this year?

Which was part of why we had to "utilize existing capacity" until a better, "fiscally responsible" solution was found for us?

The Tuscarora boundaries are not occurring in a bubble.

Our kids down here are already displaced.

Will the eighth graders sent to Stone Hill come back to Freedom for two years, and then get sent off to HS6 (with other Dulles kids from Brambleton, or Broadlands, or even Ashburn Farm) when it has jumped us?

That will be A-OK though, right?

For the greater good of some?

I guess this means the operating budget can be fully funded, since it apparently WASN'T crucial to suspend capital improvements this year?

Ridiculous.

Posted by BarbaraMunsey (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 3:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The School Board public input session for these boundary changes are tomorrow, March 23rd and Wednesday the 25th at 6:30. Come and speak or live with the consequences.

Posted by ashburnfarmmom (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 4:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

http://loudounextra.washingtonpost.com/b...

get a load of the new entry transferred from Lansdowne Living:

Apparently a LOT of public input has been added, and at finance committee meetings too!

Mrs. Waters and Mr. Ohneiser have arranged it so people who support HS6 (which has apparently been moved to Brambleton--or else the people advocating for it just don't know where it is) can get two minutes apiece to speak in favor of this fiasco.

It is unclear whether people who oppose it get equal time.

I think we ought to find out!

Posted by BarbaraMunsey (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 8:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thank you for writing on this subject. There are two factual errors in the story that get at the heart of the debate for Ashburn residents. The two high schools you mentioned as releasing the strain on Stone Bridge High School are not in Ashburn, although you say so in the story. HS-6 would be in Loudoun Valley Estates. Briar Woods High School is in Brambleton. The concern for Ashburn residents is that although we have a High School located in our community, Stone Bridge, our children would be sent outside our community to either Brambleton or Loudoun Valley Estates to attend high school.

Posted by USCchrisgd (anonymous) on March 22, 2009 at 9:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Building HS6 does not solve the Lansdowne problem. Let's say that Lansdowne moves to one of the Leesburg schools. Once HS6 is built (whenever), Lansdowne will be moved back. To where? My guess is Stone Bridge. Again, Ashburn Farm kids will be moved out of SBHS. Are we going to go through this mess all over again then? Until a HS is built in the Rt. 7 corridor, this problem will continue to exist, pushing Lansdowne/Ashburn kids south. Just so you know, I live in River Creek and could care less where my kids go (currently it is Reid Elem, Harper Park & Heritage). Would moving schools be a bummer for my kids? Yes, they would miss their friends, but they would make new ones. In fact, they have some really good friends in Lansdowne, so I'd love it if we went to school together. This boundary process is really messed up. I actually find it silly that we pass 2 elementary schools to get to the one that we go to. JMHO

Posted by jmkcajlee (anonymous) on March 23, 2009 at 9:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)

and what happens when Briar Woods and HS-6 gets over crowded with SOUTH RIDING kids-- hummm looks like Ashburn Farm kids will be pushed back to Stone Bridge. No, the answer is not a new school at this time- it is using what we have! Can't very well staff a new school anyway, apparently we have no money for teachers- they are all waiting for the RIF notices in April.

Posted by nibsthecat10 (anonymous) on March 23, 2009 at 3:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)